On password-protecting fic

[emmagrant01]

This issue comes up every now and then, and I want to know if anyone can answer this question:

If I own a web page on which I post my NC-17 fan fiction, clearly labeled as adult-oriented material, am I legally obligated to actively prevent minors from accessing that material? That is, if I know someone who's 16 is reading my fic, am I legally required to do something to prevent them from having access to it?



I keep hearing that I'm not legally obligated to do such a thing, but I'd like to know for sure. Of course, I think password-protecting fic is a waste of time, for many reasons:

1) If someone really wants to read my fic, they'll get around any system I can devise.
2) The more complex my system is, the more time is required from me to maintain it, which detracts from the reason I'm here in the first place --- to read and write fic.
3) The more complex my system is, the more likely it is that adults will inadvertently be prevented from accessing my fic. Some might even decide it isn't worth the trouble, and won't bother emailing me for the password. And I'll admit I do this myself. Unless a fic comes highly recommended, I tend to pass on by if I'm required to register or request a password. Not worth the time and effort, IME. There's plenty of great fic out there.
4) It isn't my job to take care of other people's kids. If your kid has spent the last four hours reading Left My Heart, and you didn't know what they were doing until they asked you what "rimming" was, you're an irresponsible parent. Don't try to foist the blame on me.
5) As jedirita recently pointed out, there is no rating system for literature in the US. If a 15-year-old wants to buy Best American Erotica, they can. We put ratings on our fic as a warning/advertisement/service for our readers. We aren't required to do so, and in the old 'zine days, fics were rarely rated.
6) When I was 13, I was writing fan fiction with mild adult content. This was in the olden days, pre-internet, but I would have loved to have beeen part of an internet fan fiction community back then. I'm incredibly envious of teenagers in fandom today, and I don't want to deny the ones who are mature enough to handle it an opportunity to participate, improve their writing, and read lots of fiction. I've met some amazing writers through LJ who are 16 and 17, and who are doing great work. I'm not going to pretend they don't exist until they pass an arbitrary birthday.



Well, now that I've got that off my chest, what do you think? In particular, if anyone knows what the law is on this, could you advise me? Point me to documentation, even? Thanks in advance.

ETA: belleweather has posted an essay explaining the legal stuff I'm wondering about. Very interesting!

Comments

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

I started reading fiction with adult content way before I was 18 and it didn't do me any bad

Yes, me too. In fact, I learned a lot about sex and sexuality without having to experiment. It actually delayed me becoming sexually active, which was a good thing. I wasn't ready for sex when I was 15, but I still needed information and an outlet for my sexuality.

But I think you are mistaken if you think parents are irresponsible if they don't know what their kids are doing every minute.

Well, we're going to have to disagree here. If it's easy to do things behind your parents' backs, they're not watching you closely enough. They don't know you very well if they aren't aware that you're involved in internet fandom, for example. As a teenager, I dated a much older man for 8 months without my parents' knowledge. It's not that I think they should have prevented me from having that relationship, but I *do* think it should have been obvious to them that I was in one. They didn't even notice! If I were a less responsible kid, I could have wound up pregnant, and they would have been blindsided. I think it *was* irresponsible of them. As a parent, part of the job is to know what your kids are doing, who they're with, and where they are. If you're not doing that, and you discover they're doing something you don't think they should be doing, blaming someone else instead of dealing with it yourself is extremely irresponsible.

I know that, for example, videos above a certain rating aren't being sold or rented to minors, but is it actually against the law for parents to let their children watch them at home anyway?

I only know that videos and literature are dealt with completely differently. That does beg the question, is fan art different from fan fiction? I have no idea!

[lauramcewan.livejournal.com]

Im' with you on that. As a parent things are sure different in POV than when I was a teen! A teen may have built up a trust with her parents, enough so that they don't feel they need to check up on every little thing. Teaching their kids personal responsibility. The teen can take that trust and tell one little lie (their idea of a little lie) becuase she knows that while mom and dad are pretty cool, this is something they WON'T be cool with (say, dating an older man, *G*) and abuses the trust. It's not found out until later, and by that time the damage is done and the parents are held at fault for trusting their heretofore trustable child.

Did that make any sense?

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

The only thing I'm really claiming here is that if parents don't bother to supervise their kids on the internet, it isn't my responsibility to do it for them. If your child spends hours a day online and you have no idea what they're doing, I do think that's irresponsible.

Everything else we've mentioned depends on far too many factors to be covered by a simplistic statement. But as a former high school teacher, I will say this: your parents could have held the school legally responsible for not informing them that you weren't in school for two and a half months, via in loco parentis. The fact that you got away with that and no one noticed is pretty ridiculous.

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

It doesn't sound like it harmed you in the long run, at least!

And that older man I dated behind my parents' backs? I married him... ;-) So sometimes kids know what's best for them.

This brings me back to one of my main points, that restricting access to NC-17 fanfic based purely on age is stupid and arbitrary! I'm all for reader responsibility. I'm not going to ID people; it's not my job to decide for them what's best for them. In the case of a minor, it's the parent's responsibility to give that kid as much or as little freedom as is appropriate. And if they aren't taking that responsibility seriously, they can't blame me for posting my fanfic on the internet.

[lauramcewan.livejournal.com]

I'm also still going to temper that with "I agree - it's not Emma's (or anyone's) job to take care of my kids - it *is* my job. I just take a bit of umbrage at the idea that I'm somehow irresponsible as a parent if I'm not holding their hand every second of every day.

I can't *fix* the situation if I don't know it's *broken* and I'm only human. I cannot know EVERYTHING - that's a teenager's job! *G*

Roy and I have made a point of teaching Katie the difference between the truth and a lie, how lying is usually wrong, how it can hurt someone. Yet she still went and told her teacher last year that she had an older brother who was killed by a drunk driver. How was I responsible for that? We took steps after we learned of the little tale, but all our teaching didn't prevent it. She had to take the lumps afterwards.

I'm going so far off topic. Basically, I agree with Emma. I just do not like the idea that parents aren't allowed to make mistakes or are considered irresponsible if their kids find smut online. I'm not looking to be *excused* just understood!

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

Of course! I'm not trying to imply that parents are responsible for everything their kids do -- that's what the juvenile justice system is for, right? My point was meant to be specifically about NC-17 fan fiction on the internet, but it got off-track a bit.

The only claim I'm going to make is related to my point number four above. If your kids are spending hours online and you don't know what they're doing, I think that's irresponsible.

[sorion.livejournal.com]

No, you're not legally obliged to password protect or otherwise secure your site.

However since it's fanfiction, the owner of said material could theoretically order you to either put up protection or stop posting.
Unless someone specifically asks you to do that, however, you don't have to.

If you've got a small, personal site, you don't have to worry.

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

Thanks!

However since it's fanfiction, the owner of said material could theoretically order you to either put up protection or stop posting.

But can they really *legally* force you to do that? They can hire a lawyer to harrass you certainly, but if you're not infringing on their copyright by making money on something that's theirs, I'm not convinced they can do anything about it. If they *could*, there'd none of us be here in the first place.

Oh YES they can

[shezan.livejournal.com]

Oh yes they can, especially when the material (HP in our case) is officially children's literature. Apparently JKR is pretty cool about the whole scene (because I can't imagine she's not aware of NC-17 fanfic; she is web-savvy, has been in HP chat rooms, and has said she reads fanfic) but even then, and I think partly to protect herself, she has said something to the effect that she objected to adult/controversial material (apologies - I don't have the exact ref.) What we do can be seen as gravely damaging to the image of the writer & the trust between her & her readers. Any parent is well-founded to worry that hir ten-year-old who loves Harry Potter may come across some seriously disturbing material produced by our own little sick selves. So we exist basically in a grey area at JKR's sufferance, and if we become too blatant, we run the risk of seeing every fan site being threatened with lawsuits. I mean, the woman's books have been burned by mad fundamentalist Christians because of the supposedly pagan references to wizardry - can you imagine what they would make of gay porn, non-con, chan, etc. and what they would do to JKR if there was any kind of suggestion that she's even vaguely cool about it?

Re: Oh YES they can

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

Okay, but is there any legal precedent for this? I don't know enough about copyright laws to know if an author really could prevent people from posting or distributing fan fiction. I've heard that Anne Rice was famous for harrassing fanfic writers, but that doesn't mean she was in the right.

My question is not whether they can harrass you, but whether the law is behind the original author or the fanfic writer when it comes to issues of copyright. Do you know?

Re: Oh YES they can

[shezan.livejournal.com]

When I wrote "they can", I meant, yes, the law is definitely behind the author; but don't take my word for it, go ask a real lawyer like ajhalluk.

Re: Oh YES they can

[belleweather.livejournal.com]

Actually, whether or not fanfiction qualifies as fair use is still quite up in the air. There is no caselaw in the UK having to do with the limits of fair use, and there's very little in the US and what there is conflicts. (I don't have the actual case names with me because my copyright book is mysteriously missing, but Haughton-Mifflin (The case about "The Wind Done Gone") is the decision that most people think expands fair use rights enough to let us do what we do, but there is a conflicting case...) So no one knows, and the biggest threat that an author can make to a fanfic writer is that they're going to try to bring a case against you.

As far as JKR is concerned, I know that she has sent "Cease and Desist" letters to some archives asking that they better protect their NC-17 Material. My understanding is that the archives chose to use passwords, rather than that being something that JKR specified in the letter. I know that she is concerned about children stumbling on to NC-17 fanfic. But if you were to chose to use a password it would be in deference to her wishes, not because she can legally "require" you to... she could potentially sue you for copyright infringement, but that doesn't give her the right to allow it and ask you to use a password.

Did that make ANY Sense?

Re: Oh YES they can

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

Yes, absolutely! Thanks! I don't suppose you'd be interested in posting something about the whole copyright issue too? *bats eyelashes*

Re: Oh YES they can

[belleweather.livejournal.com]

I'd be happy to, but I want to wait until after Thursday which is when we talk about fanfiction and fair use in my copyright class. :) Not that the whole issue isn't terrifying, because I'm sure I'm going to our myself, but I'm interested to see what my professor has to say about it.

[sorion.livejournal.com]

But can they really *legally* force you to do that?

Well... I'd say it's a grey area. But it has been done, before.
Anne Rice keeps doing it to all the fanfiction on her works and J.K.R made HP sites with adult content put up a barrier.

So, yes, they obviously can force you, by using a back door...
An artist can force you to stop posting stories with their characters. Now, if that artist sais he'll leave you alone, as soon as you put up a barrier, he can do that.

Unless, of course, the internet finally gets some legal ground rules -_-'

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

J.K.R made HP sites with adult content put up a barrier.

My understanding was that this was really about putting up a warning, stating that this fic contains adult content, and you really shouldn't be here if you're not an adult.

That's very different from the writer or web site owner having to check IDs at the door. That's what I don;t want to do, and I don't think I am obligated in any way to do that. I have no problem putting up a warning. But it isn't my responsibility if people ignore it.

Oh, yeah, I've heard the Anne Rice horror stories, but my impression was that she was harrassing people, and didn't really have a legal leg to stand on. Harrassment is still bad, of course!

[thalia]

I think the restricted section did start password protecting as a result of the C&D they got, but it's not clear to me whether the C&D had any legal standing or they just did it because they thought it would end the hassle. The C&D, after all, told them to stop operating altogether, and they didn't do that.

P.S.

[thalia]

I *think* there's a lawyer on the chanslash list who's expressed opinions about things like this, but I could be misremembering. master_chatnoir is a lawyer, but I don't know if she knows anything about this stuff at all.

Re: P.S.

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

Oooh! I was really hoping a lawyer would notice this post and tell me what the legality of this all is.

[sorion.livejournal.com]

Oh, yeah, I've heard the Anne Rice horror stories, but my impression was that she was harrassing people, and didn't really have a legal leg to stand on.

Oh, she does sue the owners of such sites. There is a reason why there aren't any more out there...

My understanding was that this was really about putting up a warning, stating that this fic contains adult content, and you really shouldn't be here if you're not an adult.

I'm not sure about that. There have been some sites that put up protection. (Not ID checks, of course.)
I mean, there were warnings, before. On all the sites.

But like I said... It's a bit hard to tell with the internet.
Unless you hear otherwise, you won't need anything but a warning.

[kyuuketsukirui.livejournal.com]

I don't know of anyone who has been sued, but I do know several people who were stalked and harrassed by Anne's lawyers. You can ask thebratqueen for more info, as she's one of the ones who was harrassed the most. But I'm fairly certain no one was actually sued.

People closed down their sites or hid them. Messageboards went into hiding under new URLs that blocked spiders, and some became members-only boards. No one spoke of the sites or the boards to people outside of the fandom. While we were able to survive (and it had the happy effect of keeping out the annoying goth teenies who make up an unfortunately large percentage of the VC fandom), it had the unfortunate effect of completely stifling the fandom. As people got distracted by LotR and other new fandoms, there were no new authors coming in to take their place. I stayed in for a long time, but was eventually distracted by a new OTP myself. I felt hugely bad about leaving the fandom because I was one of the few remaining really active authors.

Anyway, recently there has been a move to stop hiding and take back the fandom. People are posting fics on their LJs unlocked (still usually have spiders blocked) and there's an open membership messageboard on EZBoard.

[sorion.livejournal.com]

Anyway, recently there has been a move to stop hiding and take back the fandom. People are posting fics on their LJs unlocked (still usually have spiders blocked) and there's an open membership messageboard on EZBoard.

It'll be interesting to watch the outcome of that...
Until there's a precedent we can't know what will happen. The law is severely lacking conserning internet questions. In the end it would depend on the judge, should someone actually dare to take it to court.
Yes... that will be interesting ^_~

[angelofmercy.livejournal.com]

All I'm going to say is that I've been reading adult fiction since I was 14 - it was and will always be easy to find...and on most things, lying about your age isn't the hardest thing to do...hell I've worked in a library where teens and sometimes preteens check out romance novels right under their parents noses...

If the kid's mature enough to handle it, they'll find it no matter what.

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

I find it interesting that there's a distinction between literature and video/film/images. Fan fiction is literature, and as such, I don't think it falls into the same category as adult films.

[helens78]

I know absolutely nothing about the law on this, but personally, I agree with every single one of those points of yours. It boils down to the fact that a.) I don't necessarily think it's bad if kids get their hands on porn, and b.) it's their parents' responsibility to keep it out of their hands if they're so inclined, not mine -- especially since if I had kids, I wouldn't be keeping porn out of their hands.

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

I also don't think it's bad for kids who are mature enough to handle adult material and whoi actively seek it out, to find it. Of course, I'm think about 14-17-year-olds here, since this is the age at which sexuality is developing anyway. they're talking about it in the locker room, at the back of the bus, and on the phone. They're curious.

I remember that feeling, and reading erotica was a great way to explore my sexuality (at the age of 14), without becoming sexually active. It actually *delayed* my becoming sexually active, because it satisfied my curiosity and convinced me I wasn't ready for sex. (There was a bit much of an "ewww" factor involved!)

I'm not saying that people should *give* kids porn. But if kids go looking for it, and are willing to ignore age warnings and lie to get it, maybe it's best that I don't stop them.

[ashkitty.livejournal.com]

I agree with you, for pretty much all the same reasons. :) I have labels on my fics, but no passwords, because I expect people to behave as adults who are responsible for themselves. I don't have kids. I don't like kids. I never signed up for anything that says I have to be responsible for the behaviour of other people's kids.

Besides, I've never actually met a child who was traumatised by reading something that was too adult for them. One of three things happens: either they say "ewww, gross" and stop reading (see? kids are smarter than their parents); they just flat out don't understand it and have forgotten about it within hours; or they go on and try to learn something from it. Kids have *gasp* sexual curiosity, but when they're not ready for it, they're generally just not interested. I remember reading a scene that disturbed me, I was probably 13 or 14, and it involved a witch and her broomstick, and yes, I was traumatised for the better part of an afternoon and decided I didn't like the book...but that was the extent of it.

And anyway, that was a fantasy novel my parents had bought for me. :p

Thanks for the excuse...

[belleweather.livejournal.com]

... I've been loooking for a reason to type all this up, but I'm afraid that it's probably going to exceed the 4000 characters and change that you're allotted in a comment.

So, I've listed out all the relevant law Here on my own journal, if you're interested.

Re: Thanks for the excuse...

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

Yay! Thanks so much!

[amberleewriter.livejournal.com]

Aside from the legalities involved - which as belleweather pointed out are all but NILL - I am in the camp that argues your point number four.

It is not my responsibility to patrol other people's children. Computers are complex tools and the internet is a large place. Any adult should know both these facts. If they allow their under-age child to surf the web unsupervised, have not discussed sex, drugs, and other "mature" topics with their child, and/or are too lazy or busy to participate fully in their child's life then it's not my job to be a babysitter for them. I wasn't paid enough to take the place of a parent when I did substitute teaching in schools and I am certainly not making enough when I put up my own personal web site or writing my personal thoughts in an online journal to be held accountable for someone elses lack of responsibility.

In this country the cry of "but what about the children!" is used for any number of inane laws and arguments that take the place of individual accountability. While I am happy to give my fics a rating (in spite of the fact that I shouldn't have to) and to warn people that they contain adult content and that they should be advised, until a law that can actually stand up to the scrutiny of the ACLU and the Supreme Court is placed into effect I'm not even going to far as to put a password on my "porn."

My HS actually had a list of banned books - among which were Of Human Bondage, Lolita, and other classics of literature. My Senior English teacher, Mrs. Powers, was the head of the English Department and was opposed to this. Since the last six weeks of Senior Session were hers to teach whatever she wished, she assigned us the following: a field trip to the Indianapolis Public Library where we would select one of the authors and books from the banned book list to do a ten page research paper on in MLA format. We then were required, in order to graduate, to give an oral presentation of that report and to discuss our book with the class. As a result, Mrs. Powers got to teach about 30 banned books and their authors in one six week period. It cheesed off the School Board but they were stuck with it.

And it's part of what made me get my undergrad in English.

The world is a large and dangerous place. Sheltering children from the realities of life does nothing to prepare them for this fact later. I see nothing shameful about sex and nothing evil about language. So as far as I'm concerned, any parent upset about the fact that their under-age kid has read my "smut" can get bent. ^_^

[kyuuketsukirui.livejournal.com]

While I am happy to give my fics a rating (in spite of the fact that I shouldn't have to)

Giving your fic a rating is not just a way of covering your ass. It is also a way of helping people find the fics they want to read, in the same way that putting the fandom and pairing in the header does. It means that if I'm in the mood to read only something porny, then I can easily find what I want.

[amberleewriter.livejournal.com]

And that's exactly why I go ahead and do it. I write het, gen, slash, and all manner of kink in original fiction and several fandoms. I think of it as a courtesy to my readers that I use my own judgment and the MPAA ratings as a guideline to give people an idea of the level of "mature" content. I have several chapters of a "gen" fic that include some rather squicky stuff with knives since someone gets a ritual tattoo. I describe melee fighting with some graphic descriptions of the deaths of people (heads rolling, getting split open, folks getting burned by monsters or tortured using fire and acid). While it's nothing you don't see in most Fantasy books these days, I do know that it could get a bit vivid for some folks and if they aren't into that sort of thing then I'm happy to let them know so they can move along. I think of it as the same as putting my fic "on the right self" in a bookstore. You know when you go to the romance section or the popular fiction area and pick up a Jackie Collins book, for example, just what you're gonna get. Since I do so many different kinds of stuff, I figure adding a rating to my fandom and pairing information in the "header" of a story just makes things an easy reference. But I'm not going to make some special "you can't go here unless you're 18 or over" splash page or password protect my site until they force me to. I don't see locks on any of the shelving in a Borders Bookstore and the only stuff that isn't simply open for anyone to get to at my local library are periodicals like Playboy. *shrugs*

[kyuuketsukirui.livejournal.com]

Oh, I don't advocate locking fics at all. But I do advocate ratings, because they help me, an adult, find the sort of fic I want to read. I don't really give a shit about someone else's kids. :-/

[amberleewriter.livejournal.com]

I don't really give a shit about someone else's kids. :-/

*ROTFL*

*snort*

You have no idea how much I needed that giggle! ^_^

[ms-mindfunk.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure about the law, but I think most internet law is bullshit anyway. COPPA and all that was designed to protect children because their parents apparently aren't intelligent or competent enough to do it themselves. It's created a huge hassle for legitimate website operators, and the ones who target kids for icky stuff aren't affected at all. It's stupid.

I have children. Several, in fact, and they all use the internet. It's my responsibility to decide what is and isn't appropriate content for them online. It's also my responsibility to prevent them from accessing content I find unacceptable. If I'm too much of a cousin humper to bother doing anything to prevent them from getting into pr0n or other adult content, then I have only myself to blame when they access that stuff. It's up to me to know what they're doing and where they're going when they're online, and if I don't, how is the website owner at fault for that? There's software for lazy parents who don't want to physically monitor their kids' online activities, so it's not like the only thing a parent can do is sit next to their child. That's still the best way to do things, but if you aren't willing to do anything to protect your kid from what you think is bad for them, deal with the consequences. It's not the website's fault that your kid wanted to see some boobies or read about Harry and Draco getting it on.

I have a big thing about parental responsibility, or the lack of it. I'm not perfect, but at least I take responsibility for properly monitoring my kids, regardless of the setting. Whether it's a park, the neighborhood, McDonald's playland or the internet, I am physically there to supervise them. There's no reason in the world that other parents can't do the same.

[eliminate.livejournal.com]

If your kid has spent the last four hours reading Left My Heart, and you didn't know what they were doing until they asked you what "rimming" was, you're an irresponsible parent. Don't try to foist the blame on me.

That made me laugh so hard...and there is a rating system on manga in the US. I've seen fourteen yearolds try to purchase OT or M manga and then get told to wait till they get older. It's quite amusing, really...

Though they can buy erotica at any age. Very interesting.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't know... because every one knows that porn stites are ment for people 18 and older but it is still easy for kids under that age to get their hands on enough pornographic material... sure porn sites take some measurements such and you have to be a member to get access to every part of the site but theres still enough you can see with out that... and also i'm a 16 year old who love your writing so no to keeping minors out!!!!

[brianne.livejournal.com]

Honestly, even if you password protect it, if someone under age wants to read it, they will.

[aiglet.livejournal.com]

At the end of the day, if the worst thing kids do on the net is to read (or the most risque thing they find to read is) LMH, then they're doing pretty well. At least LMH has the value of being well-written!

Honestly, HP fanfic represents such a miniscule portion of the pr0n on the internet that it seems silly to worry about kids reading it just because of it porniness. Most kids won't read stuff they aren't ready for anyway.

I just like ratings because I like knowing what I'm getting myself into (especially when I'm reading from work).

[(Anonymous)]

I don’t know about the law but I would think/hope that you posting a disclaimer somewhere on your page should be enough. There are plenty of TV shows that give on basic channels that say – show may be inappropriate for young viewers. To me that’s the same thing. You’re warning people.

So I say keep things as they are.

[alchemia.livejournal.com]

I didnt get thru readign every reply so forgive me if this was stated before. If you don't like using passwords, but want to make your site 'child safe' so to say, you can register your site with a service like SafeSurf. You fill out a survey on your site's content, and are given a code to put on your page. This then allows your site to be blocked by Parental Software.

[hearts-n-roses.livejournal.com]

I don't know of any law that requires you to password protect fanfiction, or any written work for that matter. Pornographic images maybe, but not literature. Even if there was, the amount of questionable material available on the internet is immense, a little fanfic would be the least of my worries.

Now as a parent of two girls age 12 and almost 15, I can honestly say if they wanna read it let them read it. I don't censor my kids, and I know not every parent agrees with my attitude. Both of my girls watch Queer as Folk and love it! My oldest daughter reads HP fanfic and ships H/D. My youngest daughter also reads fic, but sticks to G/PG rated humor fics mostly because reading about sex just doesn't interest her yet. If they are old enough to understand sex, and the emotions behind it, then I don't see why they aren't old enough to read about it. As I said, my girls love Queer as Folk. They adore the characters and the storylines, that being said, my youngest daughter will close her eyes during graphic sex scenes. It's just not something she is ready to see. My oldest daughter isn't phased by it at all. There is nothing worse in there than in half the movies they watch and half the prime time tv shows out there. I have a bigger issue with violence than I do sex, but even that I don't censor if they feel they are mature enough to handle it.

We are a very open family. No subject is taboo, and my girls know they can talk about anything in my presence, and they have. I feel like this discussion with them is valuable and alot of it arises from things they see or read. This is the real world, and sex is part of real life, if they feel they are ready to read about it, who am I to say their not.

Now this is my opinion as a parent, and I know many people disagree. I'm not trying to argue it at all. It's just my thoughts, and everyone has a right to raise there own children as they see fit.

Guess I got a little OT there, but only kinda. I'm sure you got my point...lol.

[luahoana.livejournal.com]

Just wanted to tell you that I agree *completely*.

[hearts-n-roses.livejournal.com]

Thanks.

A lot of people don't, and that's ok too.

[luahoana.livejournal.com]

I've been reading books with adult content since I was 13... mostly because of the story, but I can't deny that I was more than interested in the sex scenes, as well ... to find out what you can do, what other people do from a different source than teen mags... and because I liked reading it.

My parents had already encouraged me to read those books a few years before (not because of the sex, that is), but at that time I was in this horse book/teenage romance novel phase and wasn't interested in the story... and I don't think I could have handled the sex very well then (*giggle* She said penis *giggle*).

I can understand why JKR wants the fanfiction sites to better protect fics with adult content ... most of the readers *are* children after all, and I would want my child - and I'm really talking about children here, not teenagers - to stumble across some intense sex scene when googling something about Harry Potter.
But IMO, children are rather good at protecting themselves from reading stuff like that - because it's just not interesting at that time (at least, this was the case with me, my friends and the children I've looked after).
I grew up in a very open and liberal environment, so sexuality was never a taboo.

The rating system of movies here in Germany is voluntary (FSK means "voluntary self-control"), and even though children are prevented from entering the adult section in video-tape libraries (there is no such section in stores), teenagers *can* go there if they look old enough, and R-rated movies are accessable to almost everyone (most of the US R-rated movies are PG-13 here, anyway).
But there is no rating system for books, either.

Back to the topic (yadda yadda...sorry)...
You put up warnings, and there isn't much else you can do...you cannot prevent every teenager from reading your stories behind their parents' backs.

If it really bothers you, you could handle it like AFF, skyehawke etc. and put up these little windows..."By clicking OK I confirm that I'm of age..." or something like that, to make sure people are really aware that they're going to read something they might not be legally allowed to read.
Or put up passwords, as already suggested...
Even then, you can't prevent underage people to click the OK button or get the password... but... oh well...

I think there are *much* worse things for teenagers to do than reading your fanfiction.

[chrysos.livejournal.com]

I agree wholeheartedly with you. If children want to read adult material, they will find a way. I also wrote mild slash at the age of 11, and read my first gay pornografic novel when I was 14 (I still have it!). It did me no harm.

Pictures however are a different matter. When someone accidentally lands on NC-17 slash he/she can read the warnings, and if that is not clear enough, they can click away when the first keyword pops up. A picture is seen in a second, you can't guard yourself against it if the subject if objectionable to you, or if you are just too young to be ready for such images. You have already seen it, it won't be easy to forget.
So, for adult art I prefer using a password or friendslock. If people requesting the password state they are over the age of consent, how can I check that? I can't. But I have at least made sure that the viewers know what to expect before looking at the picture.

Sorry, got a bit OT here I believe ;)